Author Topic: Final flight for UK's Harriers at RAF Cottesmore  (Read 2346 times)

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Offline casper

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Final flight for UK's Harriers at RAF Cottesmore
« on: December 15, 2010, 12:36:38 PM »
The Harrier jump jet will make its final operational flight on Wednesday, leaving from RAF Cottesmore in Rutland.
One of Britain's greatest technical achievements was retired early after falling victim to defence cuts.
In celebration of the aircraft, Harriers will pass over seven   military bases, the town centres of Stamford and Oakham, and Lincoln   Cathedral.
The Harriers will be decommissioned in 2011 to be replaced by the Joint Strike Fighter by the end of the decade.
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The Harriers will be decommissioned in 2011 to be replaced by the Joint Strike Fighter by the end of the decade.
If an alien were to read that how stupid would they think the government are?

Offline Angry Turnip

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Re: Final flight for UK's Harriers at RAF Cottesmore
« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2010, 01:54:03 PM »
You don`t need to be an alien to see how stupid this descision is.
You scrap something when you have a suitable replacement,not ten years before. :o
 
Yet again the UK government have needlessly withdrawn an iconic aircraft early to apprently save money.
 
If it`s about money then the Tornado`s should have got the chop-they are much more costly to operate,and less reliable than the Harrier.
The Typhoon is already replacing the Tornado`s in service,so to retire the Tornado early would seem to be the sensible choice-but not to our government. ::)

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Re: Final flight for UK's Harriers at RAF Cottesmore
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2010, 02:00:48 PM »
Its the way the whole thing is made to sound so casual that is so infuriating. They make it sound as if the F-35 is coming into service in 2012 as opposed to 2022!!!

Dying to know how they plan to influence world events for the next 10years.

 >:( >:( >:(

There's another article on the BBC News site about the Harrier and the controversy its withdrawal has prompted. Apparently the MoD could have saved approx. £8 BILLION by scrapping the Tornado instead of the proposed £1 Billion that'll be saved by scrapping the Harrier.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2010, 02:04:20 PM by casper »
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Hammerhead

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Re: Final flight for UK's Harriers at RAF Cottesmore
« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2010, 08:24:36 PM »
Not looking great for the rest of the front-line aircraft either...  ::)

Quote
"We are heading for five Typhoon squadrons and one JSF [Joint Strike
Fighter] squadron," said Air Vice-Marshal Greg Bagwell, who commands the
RAF's air combat group. "It will be a six-squadron world; that's what's on
the books."

That could mean 107 Typhoons, plus about 40 F-35C JSFs that support a large
operational squadron of 20 to 25 crews, Bagwell said.
Typhoon numbers could be clipped even further if Britain and Oman seal a
deal to send the Persian Gulf nation about a squadron's worth of aircraft.
The planes could be diverted from an existing RAF order; the question is
whether they will then later be replaced, he said.
In 1990, the RAF had 33 fast-jet squadrons; in 2003, 17. Today, the number
stands at 12: seven Tornado, three Typhoon and two Harrier squadrons, plus
the offensive firepower of a growing fleet of Reaper UAVs.
By April, Britain will be down to eight fast-jet squadrons, thanks to the
retirement of the Harriers and the shelving of two Tornado units.
The Tornado force has already been eroded by a covert 2009 order from the
previous Labour administration to cut the number of crews in each squadron.
But that number is expected to return to its previous level next year as
squadrons are eliminated and crews shift around.
Those cuts, and others, were ordered by an October decision to ax defense
spending over the next four years as part of a wider government plan to
reduce public borrowing levels. The cuts bit deep into RAF capabilities;
other reductions hit battlefield surveillance, maritime reconnaissance,
helicopter transport and other capabilities.
"Six squadrons is the low point for the U.K.'s fast jet fleet," one analyst
said. "You can expect that to recover a little as the Ministry of Defence
bolsters its force of Joint Strike Fighters beyond the current level
mandated in the new strategic defense and security review."
Bagwell was less sanguine. He called the first JSF squadron a "start point"
and said more may come, but for the moment, "I expect a single squadron in
2020 and that's it."
Other senior RAF officers have said they aim eventually to operate around
100 F-35Cs, which will split their time operating from land bases and from
the new Queen Elizabeth-class aircraft carriers being built for the Royal
Navy.
Bagwell said the fast-jet cuts were challenging but manageable so long as
the RAF is not tasked to do much more than its current deployments: Tornados
to the NATO effort in Afghanistan, and Typhoons to quick reaction alert
(QRA) forces in Britain and the Falkland Islands.
"Am I happy to be down at that number [eight squadrons] next April? No, it
worries the hell out of me because it's a small combat air force," he said.
"I can just about do Op Herrick [Afghanistan] and the QRAs. Can I do other
things? Yes, but it is at risk.
"Actually, I am more worried about what other people think I can do
tomorrow," he said. "The whole thing about procurement and posture is as
much about long-term future deterrence and keeping the enemy on the back
foot as it is about physically fighting. The deterrence and coercive effect
of air power has somehow got lost in the noise."
Typhoon Questions
Bagwell said the RAF would likely ax its 55 Tranche 1 Typhoons by mid-decade
because it would cost too much to bring them up to the required multirole
standards offered by Tranche 2 and Tranche 3. That would mean the RAF
Typhoon fleet would top out at 107 machines.
But the Typhoon fleet could shrink even further, Bagwell said.
The "great unknown in the plans is the awful lot of potential export
customers," he said.
The proposed deal with Oman is in the final stages of negotiation;
discussions are now underway about where those dozen or so aircraft might
come from. The RAF's Typhoon force could fall further if the planes are
diverted from the Air Force's order and are not replaced.
Difficulties in Britain's 72-plane sale to Saudi Arabia are creating more
uncertainty. The first 24 are being diverted from the RAF's Tranche 2 order,
and the service is to get more Tranche 3 aircraft instead. The other 48 are
to be assembled in Saudi Arabia as part of an effort to build up local
industry.
But industry sources said the plan has run into difficulties that raise
questions about how Britain will fill the Saudi order.
Bagwell said options could include taking additional aircraft from the RAF
production run and replacing them later.
"Should we get the buybacks out of Saudi Arabia and Oman as planned, we will
be back to the number of Typhoons I need," he said. "At the moment, if I
don't get the [Omani] buyback and this is under discussion ... it could take
me down to 95 aircraft."
He said any changes to RAF deliveries would affect the service's ability to
train crews.
A spokesman for BAE Systems, which is helping to build the aircraft, said he
couldn't comment on Saudi issues.
Bagwell also revealed:
¦ The 2011 planning round could change the timing of the upgrade of Typhoon
jets to a full multirole aircraft. Dubbed the Future Capabilities Program 2,
it will allow the jets to carry Storm Shadow, Brimstone and other weapons.
¦ The decision to switch the planned purchase of short-takeoff,
vertical-landing F-35Bs to the conventional carrier C version will give the
Air Force a true deep-penetration capability.
¦ The Sentinel R1 surveillance capability, to be axed by the government
after the Afghanistan war, could be replaced through programs like the
Scavenger UAV and new active electronically scanned array radars on Typhoon
and JSF.
¦ The 2011 planning round may speed up creation of the final two Typhoon
squadrons, now slated for 2015, by as much as a year.
Bagwell told reporters that the date on which the RAF hits six squadrons
would depend in part on Ministry of Defence decisions about the drawdown of
the Tornado strike aircraft as Typhoons arrive.
"We still need to hold on to a portion of the Tornado force, and it will be
a very important decision for the next defense review [expected in 2015] as
to how the crossover is achieved between Typhoon and Tornado," he said. "My
gut instinct is that we will need at least two or three Tornado squadrons at
the 2017 point, keeping the squadron numbers at the six to eight figure."
The Tornado fleet is currently scheduled to retire in 2021. The government
recently announced a reduction in the number of Tornados required to sustain
ongoing operations, known as force elements, from 40 to 18 by 2015.
Elizabeth Quintana, head of air power and technology at the Royal United
Services Institute, said she didn't think air power suffered worse in the
cuts than many other sectors.
"The benefit is that unlike the Army [spared the worst of the cuts due to
the war in Afghanistan], the Air Force now knows what its configuration is
going to look like in the 2017-2020 timeframe," she said. "Where aircraft
numbers are going in the future and what impact unmanned combat air vehicles
might have is too early to say. F-35 and Typhoon give you more capable
platforms but with fewer numbers."
She noted that synthetic training will reduce the number of aircraft kept
off the front lines.                                       

Offline Steve7

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« Last Edit: December 17, 2010, 12:46:43 PM by Steve7 »